9/10-11 Willow race report

#1

Awesome weekend in the valley: moderate NE wind, highs in the low 80’s (which is unheard of for this time of year), just simply a beautiful sunny day.

I ran with the GTS folks this weekend, which had a field of 5 cars. This way I was able to grid with the other BMWs, and try out a set of 225 RA-1s.

On Saturday we were given our own green flag. I tried my best to keep up, but was simply out-horsepowered and trailed from green to checker. For Sunday’s race we had one green, and the grid was lead by HC cars, followed by spec 944, SE-R, spec Miata, and lastly GTS. The BMW’s had a great start, and by the first corner I was leading both Miatas, one SE-R, and both 944s (iirc). I followed Rich Elliot in his GTS2 e30 for the entire race, with a gap that ranged from 6" to 20 or so car lenghts. Rich’s car was much faster than mine on the straights (I think he estimated that he had ~ 45whp on me), but his tires were falling off quickly from mid-race on, and I was able to squeak by him 5 turns before the checker.

The best news for me was that with the benefits of losing 22 lbs from my roof (I’d removed the sunroof mech since my last race), running 225/45/15 RA-1’s, cooler weather, and a little drafting help from Rich, I undercut my previous best laptime at Willow by 2.3 seconds!!!

I know that the subject of which tires to spec was discussed at length previously, and the decision to go with 205s was made for various reasons. I have to say, though, that I was simply blown away by the additional grip the 225s offered, especially on getting the power down on exits. If they did decrease acceleration due to > rolling resistence, that was more than made up for in higher corner exit speeds.

:whistle:

I’m anxious to hear if Mikes spec cars ran ok up in northern CA this weekend!

#2

Steve:

I’m glad to hear that you had a good weekend.

Regarding the tire choice, we chose the 205 tire size because we wanted a tire that would work well on the cars, and that will save a little money. Yes, the 225’s shave a few tenths off the lap times (I’d bet your times are better mainly because you’re driving faster) but like any mod that costs more money, and that everyone gets, what’s the point?

If we go to the 225’s, everyone will go a little faster around the track but we’ll all have the same relative lap times. Yes, it’s in our nature to want to go faster but there is no net gain, within our Spec E30 series, if we go to the biggger tires. We will, however, spend more money. Will it be a lot more money? No. But if we change this rule, there will be many more "Why can’t we do this…and this…and this" requests.

In SCCA, the rules changed monthly. At Spec E30, this is not going to happen. Sure, you’re the only Spec E30 racer in SoCal and we appreciate you being there. Because of you planting the seed, there are more cars being built in your area right now.

But if you go out on your own and use parts that are not a part of our program, this will encourage others to do the same…and then the program breaks-down and we’re right back into the same kind of racing that everyone else is doing.

Virtually everytime I talk to a 944 Cup guy here in the east, he’ll tell me that he wishes they would have a spec tire and size. They don’t like the fact that the guys who have more money, can outspend them…especially on tires.

Of course, no one is going to protest you for having a 225 tire on your car and I’m not going to fly out to enforce our rules on one car. But if you’re racing with a car (or parts) that isn’t a part of the Spec E30 program, you’re not racing a Spec E30 car.

Early in the Spec E30 lifetime, we had a few guys ask about the 225 tires but since we’ve been racing (with ten cars per event,) the tire issue has dissappeared. No one ever asks about the 225’s. Never.

Now that we’re expanding to other areas, the only way we can avoid a breakdown (which is bad for everyone) is for all our drivers to stay with the program. There are plenty of other classes that allow more mods but the Spec E30 program is working as-is. We can have all the rules in the world but when it gets down to it, it’s up to our drivers to keep it working well.

Carter

#3

Carter wrote:

[quote]Steve:

Of course, no one is going to protest you for having a 225 tire on your car and I’m not going to fly out to enforce our rules on one car. But if you’re racing with a car (or parts) that isn’t a part of the Spec E30 program, you’re not racing a Spec E30 car.

Now that we’re expanding to other areas, the only way we can avoid a breakdown (which is bad for everyone) is for all our drivers to stay with the program. There are plenty of other classes that allow more mods but the Spec E30 program is working as-is. We can have all the rules in the world but when it gets down to it, it’s up to our drivers to keep it working well.

Carter[/quote]

Thanks for the response. I definitely was not racing as a spec e30 this weekend, and did not mean to imply that I was. Rather, I signed up and raced as a GTS1 car. I decided to run GTS so that I would be able to grid with, and race with, the other BMW’s in the field. No knock on spec e30! I am thrilled that others have started to get spec cars built out here, and fully intend to race with (and beat!) them as a spec car once they hit the tracks.

I also decided to go with a larger tire (and remove the plastic behind the drivers-side headlight :stuck_out_tongue: ) in hopes that this may help me to be more competitive in that class. I completely understand the decision to go with the 205 tire for cost reasons. And I understand your statement that if everyone is running on the same tire, it doesn’t matter what that tire is. Actually, that is really what drove me to using a larger tire this weekend - to use the same tire size as others in the class I was running in. I did not see the sense in disadvantaging myself by using the smaller spec tire while running in a class that allowed larger tires. I just thought I’d share my experiences with the 225s - apologies if this was misconstrued as whining about the spec tire as it was not meant to be. Trust me, I would love to believe that the drop in my laptimes was primarily due to my driving, but I really doubt that was the case.

Last, when I have signed up as a spec e30 car I have run the spec (205) tire and, to my knowledge, been 100% in compliance with the rules. Really nothing to protest out here in CA. Well, other than the housing prices, mayoral scandals, taxes, etc… but that belongs in another forum!

#4

Steve:

I appreciate you mentioning that fact that were registered as a GTS car. And I never felt like you were whining but I did want to explain the reasoning behind our decision to use the 205 tire.

Please continue to give us good reports (even when you race in GTS) and know that we support you and all others who are currently or planning to race Spec E30.

'See you next season on the track…got those cars ready yet Mike?

Carter

:woohoo:

#5

Spill, Steve. What times did you run?

#6

pig4bill wrote:

My best lap was 1:39.7. I know there’s at least 1.5 more seconds to be had, and will be heading back next weekend to see if I can find them! Then I think I may have to take a break until Cal Speedway in the spring.

#7

That’s impressive. A friend of mine runs 1:37’s in his Eclipse, but he’s got 300 hp, coilovers, stripped interior and big Wilwoods. I wouldn’t think an e30 with minimal suspension mods coupld get very close to him.

#8

Steve, seeing as how you’re West Coast points leader, are you going to the NASA Nationals in Ohio?

#9

pig4bill wrote:

Not unless I can get someone to haul my car there out of the kindness of their hearts - that’s a bit too far of a drive. Sears Point was bad enough! (great track, though)

#10

Sweet, you’ll be there this weekend Steve? I’m thinking about taking the Coupe for a little drive and Mike Andre is going to be up at the Willow Time Trial this weekend as well…hmmm…

#11

sdais wrote:

[quote]pig4bill wrote:

Not unless I can get someone to haul my car there out of the kindness of their hearts - that’s a bit too far of a drive. Sears Point was bad enough! (great track, though)[/quote]

I know of a trailer you could probably borrow…open trailer, dual axle, brakes on both axles, etc…couldn’t tow it behind the M5 though :P.

#12

Ben Carufel wrote:

[quote]sdais wrote:

[quote]pig4bill wrote:

Not unless I can get someone to haul my car there out of the kindness of their hearts - that’s a bit too far of a drive. Sears Point was bad enough! (great track, though)[/quote]

I know of a trailer you could probably borrow…open trailer, dual axle, brakes on both axles, etc…couldn’t tow it behind the M5 though :P.[/quote]

any chance it might be available this weekend? I’ve been hunting through the yellow pages looking for a trailer, but so far have come up short. I’d be happy to hand over a reasonable fee.

You going to be at the big track with Orange County Racing or streets?

Post edited by: sdais, at: 2005/11/02 19:31

#13

sdais wrote:

[quote]Ben Carufel wrote:

[quote]sdais wrote:

[quote]pig4bill wrote:

Not unless I can get someone to haul my car there out of the kindness of their hearts - that’s a bit too far of a drive. Sears Point was bad enough! (great track, though)[/quote]

I know of a trailer you could probably borrow…open trailer, dual axle, brakes on both axles, etc…couldn’t tow it behind the M5 though :P.[/quote]

any chance it might be available this weekend? I’ve been hunting through the yellow pages looking for a trailer, but so far have come up short. I’d be happy to hand over a reasonable fee.

You going to be at the big track with Orange County Racing or streets?Post edited by: sdais, at: 2005/11/02 19:31[/quote]

Haven’t decided which yet. I’ll be at both maybe? I just want to watch some good racing. Not sure if I want to put that many miles on the Coupe though…it’s only had a couple hundred over the past year.

Will have more trailer info momentarily. What’s your tow vehicle?

#14

pig4bill wrote:

Bill - I found another 1.4 of the 2 seconds I was hoping for: running a 1:38.3 on Sunday morning. My car is set up in "KP Guise", meaning 225 RA-1’s & chip. What really impressed me about my time was that my tires this weekend were well past their useful life, meaning they were within a few hair-widths of the cords. Also, on that lap I still left 2.5 feet of trackout on turn 9 and maybe a foot or so on turn 1. This means that by using all of the pavement I probably could’ve taken both of those turns at 2-4 miles per hour faster. Based on that, I would bet that my car (as set-up) could take Willow at 137 flat, and that a car set up to spec could easily break into the 138s.

Speaking of HP, during the saturday race I finished within a few car lenths of a FFR & a camaro which were (according to the owners) putting out 320 & 370 HP respectively. Both of them nearly fell over when I told them I had the stock (~170HP) motor in my car.

#15

Nice! What group were you racing with?

Have you ever run Laguna Seca? That’s the place I really want to run. Unfortunately, track and race days there are few and far between, other than SCCA.

#16

I was out with West Coast Racing (formerly the West Coast Pantera Club). Very nice group of guys. For the most part they don’t take this real seriously and are just out to have fun.

I’ve run Laguna once - it’s definitely God’s gift to racers.

#17

That’s part of the reason I’m going racing. With Laguna’s strict sound limits, race weekends are the only time I can let the motor rip.

#18

Laguna has sound limits on race weekends too. You get a few extra db, but unless you’re running in the Historics or World Challenge, you still have to meet sound.

#19

Yep. I’m at 95dB now so I need all the extra dB I can get at a race weekend, and I haven’t taken out my cat yet.